The transcript is below.
As transcribed by the Minneapolis airport police:
Investigative Sergeant Dave Karsnial#4211 (OK) and Detective Noel Nelson #62
(NN) INTERVIEW WITH Larry Craig (LC)Case 07002008
LC: Am I gonna have to fight you in court?
OK: No. No. I’m not gonna go to court u11ess you want me there.LC: ‘Cause I don’t want to be in court either.
OK: Ok. I donât either.(inaudible)
DK: Um, here’s the way it works, urn, Youâll you’ll be released today. okay.
LC: OkayDK: All right. I. I know I can bring you to jail, but that’s not my goal here, okay? (inaudible)
LC: Don’t do that. You YouDK: Iâm not going to bring you to jail
LC: You solicited me.DK: Okay. Weâre going to get. Weâre going to get into that. (inaudible)
LC: Okay.DK: But thereâs the, there thereâs two ways, yes. You can, you can, ah, you can go to court. You can plead guilty.
LC: Yep.DK: Thereâll be a fine. You wonât have to explain anything. (inaudible) I know.
LC: Right.DK: And youâll pay a fine, you be (inaudible) done. Or if you want to plead not guilty, as, and I, I canât make these decisions for you.
LC: No, no. Just tell me where I am (inaudible) I need to make this flight.DK: Okay. Okay. And then I go to people that are not guilty, then I would have to come to court and end up testifying. So those are the two things, okay. Did I explain that part?
LC: Yes.DK: Okay. Um, ah, Iâm just going to read you your rights real quick, okay? You got it on?
NN: Yep.
DK: Okay.DK: Ah, the date is 6/11/07 at 1228 hours. Um, Mr. Craig?
LC: Yes.DK: Sorry about that. (Ringing phone)
DK: You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used against you in court of law. You have the right to talk to a lawyer now or have a present, a lawyer present now or anytime during questioning. If you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be appointed to you without cost. Do you understand each of these rights the way I have explained them to you?
LC: I do.DK: DO you wish to talk to us at this time?
LC: I do.DK: Okay. Um, I just wanna start off with a your side of the story, okay. So, a
LC: So I go into the bathroom here as I normally do. Iâm a commuter too here.DK: Okay.
LC: I sit down, um, to go to the bathroom and ah, you said our feet bumped. I believe they did, ah, because I reached down and scooted over and um, the next thing I knew, under the bathroom divider comes a card that says Police. Now, um (sigh) thatâs about as far as I can take it, I donât know of anything else. Ah, your foot came toward mine, mine came towards yours, was that natural? I donât know. Did we bump? Yes. I think we did. You said so. I donât disagree with that.DK: Okay. I donât want to get into a pissing match here.
LC: Weâre not going to.DK: Good. Um.
LC: I donât, ah, I am not gay, I donât do these kinds of things andâ¦DK: It doesnât matter. I donât care about sexual preferences or anything like that. Hereâs your stuff back sir. Um, I donât care about sexual preference.
LC: I know you donât Youâre out enforce the law.DK: Right.
LC: But you should be out to entrap people either.DK: This isnât entrapment.
LC: All right.DK: Um, you, youâre skipping some parts here, but what about your hand?
LC: What about it? I reached down my foot like this. There was a piece of paper on the floor. I picked it up.DK: Okay.
LC: What about my hand?Well, youâre not being truthful with me. Iâm kinda disappointed in you Senator. Iâm real disappointed in you right now. Okay, Iâm not, just so you know, just like everybody. I, I, I treat with dignity. I try to pull them away from the situation.
LC: I, IDK: and not embarrass them
LC: I appreciate that.DK: And I
LC: You did that after the stall.DK: I will say every person Iâve had so far has told me the truth. Weâve been respectful to each other and theyâve gone on their way. And Iâve never had to bring anybody to jail because everyoneâs been truthful with me.
LC: I donât want you to take me to jail and I think.DK: Iâm not gonna take you to jail as long as your cooperative but Iâm not gonna lie. Weâ¦
LC: Did my hand come back below the divider? Yes, it did.DK: Okay, sir. We deal with people that lie to us everyday.
LC: Iâm sure you do.DKâ Iâm sure you do to sir.
LC: And gentleman so do I.DK: Iâm sure you do. We deal with a lot of people that are very bad people. Youâre not a bad person.
LC: No, I donât think I am.DK: Okay, so what Iâm telling you, I donât want to be lied to.
LC: Okay.DK: Okay. So weâll start over, youâre gonna get out of here. Youâre gonna have to pay a fine and that will be it. Okay. I donât call media, I donât do any of that type of crap.
LC: Fine.DK: All right, so letâs start from the beginning. You went into the bathroom.
LC: I went in the bathroom.DK: And what did you do whenâ¦
LC: I stood beside the wall, waiting for a stall to open. I got in the stall, sat down, and I started to go to the bathroom. Ah, did our feet come together, apparently the did bump. Well, I wonât dispute that.DK: Okay. When I got out of the stall, I noticed other other stalls were open.
LC: They were at the time. At the time I entered, I, I at the time I entered, I stood and waited.DK: Okay.
Investigative Sergeant Dave Karsoia!#4211 (OK) and Detective Noel Nelson #62
(NN) INTERVIEW WITH Larry Craig (LC)
Case 07002008LC: They were all busy, you know
DK: Were you (inaudible) out here while you were waiting? 1could see your eyes. I saw you playing with your fingers and then look up. Play with your fingers and then look up.
LC: Did I glance at your stall? I was glancing at a stall right beside yours waiting for a fella to empty it. I saw him stand up and therefore I thought it was going to empty.DK: How long do you think you stood outside the stalls?
LC: Oh a minute or two at the most.DK: Okay. And when you went in the stalls, then what?
LC: Sat down.DK: Okay. Did you do anything with your feet?
LC: Positioned them, I don’t know. I donât know at the time. I’m a fairly wide guy. ,DK: I understand.
LC: I had to spread my legs.DK: Okay. ,
LC: When I lower my pants so they wonât slide.DK: Okay.
LC: Did I slide them too close to yours? Did I, I looked down once, your foot was dose to mine.DK: Yes.
LC: Did we bump? Ah, you said so, I don’t recall that, but apparently we were close.DK: Yeah, well your foot did touch mine, on my side of the stall.
LC: All right.DK: Okay. And then with the hand. Urn, how many times did you put your hand under the stall?
LC: I don’t recall I remember reaching down once. There was a piece of toilet paper back behind me and picking it up.DK: Okay. Was your was your palm down or up when you were doing that?
LC: I don’1 recall.’DK: Okay. I recall your palm being up. Okay.
LC: All right.DK: When you pick up a piece of paper off the ground, your palm would be down, when you pick something up.
LC: Yeah, probably would be. I recall picking the paper up.DK: And I know it’s hard to describe here on tape but actually what I saw was your fingers come underneath the stalls, you’re actually ta touching the bottom of the stall divider.
LC: I donât recall that.DK: You donât recall.
LC: I donât believe I did that. I donât.DK: I saw, I saw
LC: I donât do those things.DK: I saw your left hand and I could see the gold wedding ring when it when it went across. I could see that. On your left hand, I could see that.
LC: Wait a moment, my left hand was over here.DK: I saw thereâs aâ¦
LC: My right hadn was next to you.DK: I could tell it with my ah, I could tell it was your left hand because your thumb was positioned in a faceward motion. Your thumb was on this side, not on this side.
LC: Well, we can dispute that. Iâm not going to fight you in court and I, I reached down with my right hand to pick up the paper.DK: But Iâm telling you that I could see that so I know thatâs your left hand. Also I could see a gold ring on this finger, so thatâs obvious it was the left hand.
LC: Yeah, okay. My left hand was in the direct opposite of the stall from you.
DK: Okay. You, you travel through here frequently correct?
LC: I do.DK: Um,
LC: Almost weekly.DK: Have you been successful in these bathrooms here before?
LC: I go to that bathroom regularlyDK: I mean for any type of other activities.
LC: No. Absolutely not. I donât seek activity in bathrooms.DK: Itâs embarrassing.
LC: Well itâs embarrassing for both⦠Iâm not gonna fight you.DK: I know youâre not going to fight me. But thatâs not the point. I would respect you and I still respect you. I donât disrespect you but Iâm disrespected right now and Iâm not trying to act like I have all kinds of power or anything, but youâre sitting here lying to a police officer.
LC: I, I, I.DK: Itâs not a (inaudible) Iâm getting from somebody else. Iâm (inaudible)
LC: (inaudible)(Talking over each other)
DK: I am trained in this and I know what I am doing. And I say you put your hand under there and youâre going to sit there andâ¦
LC: I admit I put my hand down.DK: You put your hand and rubbed it on the bottom of the stall with your left hand.
LC: No. Wait a moment.DK: And I. Iâm not dumb, you can say I donât recallâ¦
LC: If I had turned sideways, that was the only way I could get my left hand over there.DK: Itâs not that hard for me to reach. (inaudible) itâs not that hard. I see it happen everyday out here now.
LC: (inaudible) you do. All right.DK: I just, I just, I guess, I guess Iâm gonna say Iâm just disappointed in you sir. Iâm just really am. I expect this from the guy that we get out of the hood. I mean, people vote for you.
LC: Yes, they do. (inaudible)DK: unbelievable, unbelievable.
LC: Iâm a respectable person and I donât do these kinds ofâ¦DK: And (inaudible) respect right now though
LC: But I didnât use my left hand.DK: I thought that youâ¦
LC: I reached down with my right hand like this to pick up a piece of paper.DK: Was your gold ring on your right hand at anytime today.
LC: Of course not, try to get it off, look at it.DC: Okay. Then it was your left hand, I saw it with my own eyes.
LC: All right, you saw something that didnât happen.DK: Embarrassing, embarrassing. No wonder why weâre going down the tubes. Anything to add?
NN: Uh, no.DK: Embarrassing. Date is 6/11/07 at 1236 interview is done.
LC: Okay.